<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Feb 5, 2018 at 1:05 PM, Timothe Litt <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:litt@ieee.org" target="_blank">litt@ieee.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><span class="gmail-">
On 05-Feb-18 12:01, Clem Cole wrote:</span> </div></blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><br>
The <b><font color="#cc33cc">word </font></b>you left out was
probably the issue. </div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff">Fair enough ..</font></div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><b>We just
didn't make adding a node to a cluster difficult and mysterious
enough.</b> <br></div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff">Right ;-)</font></div><br></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
So product management's conservatism is understandable, given the
risk that the SPD won't be re-read when the function of a node
changes, and the resulting data corruption being laid at DEC's
feet. </div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default"><font color="#0000ff"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Point taken, but DEC used the SPD as its primary defense for exactly this type of problem. It was the 'legal' definition of what was and was not allowed. But as you point out, that behavior does not always make for happy customers or sr managers.</font></font></div><br></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<br>So, the counter-argument becomes "how much engineering should be
invested in allowing a customer to save $100 on the cost of a PCI
card?" And the easy answer is one of "none" and "it's not a
priority". Ship only cluster capable hardware, and "problem
solved". Not all engineering problems are best solved with
engineering solutions. But I'll grant that the engineering would be
a lot more fun :-)<br></div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"></font><font color="#0000ff"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">I hear you and your are 100% correct -- that is exactly the way it would have been (was) handled. The truth is in at least Tru64 (I think is was Feed Knight - Mr. SCSI) had code that detect when your SCSI bus was being shared. It would have been easy to add add a side look up to check the control being used and if it was not in the official table, produce a boot message saying -- "<i>shared bus with unsupported SCSI controller, please remove sharing or replace controller and reboot."</i></font></font></div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff">But I could never get marketing to accept that.</font></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff">But I agree, the fact is that somebody would have tried to do it. My point was that if we detected it (which was not not that hard), then we could have at least said something. And in practice if you still ignored it and it was in all those system logs, it would have been pretty easy to say to the end customer, <i>we told you not to do that</i>.</font></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font color="#0000ff"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Then again to your point - I know of a case where a VPN manufacturer as told its customer not configure their VPN's the way the customer does, but said customer's IT dept insists on doing it differently anyway - much to the internal </font></font><font color="#0000ff" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">development engineers </font><font color="#0000ff"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">(</font></font><font color="#0000ff" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">@ the customer) distress. In this case, its a switch, the customer are being more conservative (and silly) than the VPN manufacturer has told it to be, but breaking a lot of things in process that should work. The local engineers b*tch because things break that should not -- and they find out it is a local cause by their own IT dept. But it is a case where the manufacturers recommendations are not being considered and things would work as expected (and tested by the manufacturer) if the SW was configured as designed.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font color="#0000ff" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font color="#0000ff" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Clem</font></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#0000ff"><br></font></div><br></div></div></div></div><div hspace="streak-pt-mark" style="max-height:1px"><img alt="" style="width:0px;max-height:0px;overflow:hidden" src="https://mailfoogae.appspot.com/t?sender=aY2xlbWNAY2NjLmNvbQ%3D%3D&type=zerocontent&guid=e36ff9da-29e5-4071-a610-63a29d6c6e14"><font color="#ffffff" size="1">ᐧ</font></div>