[Simh] OpenVMS Hobbyist Program

[Johnny Billquist]

Hmm. You seem to be a bit confused... Let me try and straighten things 
out...

On 2020-03-08 05:21, Dan Gahlinger wrote:
> is it still technically pirating if it's impossible to legally buy it 
> because it's a dead product?

Yes. It is still owned by someone. That doesn't end just because they 
won't sell it to you.

> I bought some vax with vms and got documentation with them including 
> licenses of vms v4.x and such,
> at least one system I'm fairly sure didn't have an expiry date that I 
> could find.
> of course the license paper says it cost about $90k USD.
> from Ebay to me for $600

There is a question if that license actually is valid for you. It does 
not have your name on it. But that is a separate questions for lawyers.

> copyright laws also differ from country to country, some places have 
> exceptions for personal use or archival purposes.

Possibly. That is something for lawyers in those countries to sort out.

> there are people out there with the pakgen ability, but I'm sure they'd 
> like to remain anonymous.
> and that becomes problematic for commercial use.

Already is. They can potentially generate license also for products that 
continues to be sold.

> HPE is basically going to put you out of business if you rely on vms for 
> anything.

No they are not. If you have a normal license, it will not expire just 
because HPE stops selling VMS. That license will continue to work just 
fine. Most normal, commerical licenses do not have an expiration date.
If you are relying on VMS for anything, and are using the hobbyist 
license, then you are essentially violating the conditions of the 
hobbyist license to start with, and you have no case to complain.

> is HPE going to sue individual hobbyists for copyright? I highly doubt it.

Why would they? HPE have given hobbyists licenses which will expire, at 
which point they just don't have a working license anymore. Not sure 
what HPE would sue for...

> I doubt commercial too unless it's high profile or a lot of business, 
> even then my argument would be - ok which license do I buy, my business 
> depends on this.

A commercial user is not going to be shut down by this announcement. At 
most, they will not have support anymore. But then again, if they want 
that, they can buy it from VSI instead. Similar conditions, probably 
similar prices. Business continues as before.

> while on the topic  what about Charon? what about those licenses?

Charon have never been owned by HPE, so obviously that product is 
unaffected. As for VMS running on those machines, it's the same story as 
all other licenses. HPE will not be selling any new licenses, and will 
not provide support anymore.
The licenses are still valid, and the systems will continue running, 
unless you only have some time limited license. Which commercial users 
usually do not have.

> I'll use the permanent license I legally purchased, if HPE wants to give 
> me flack for personal, hobbyist use, try me...

If you have a permanent license, then it is going to be valid 
permanently. The current announcement from HPE do not invalidate it. Why 
do you even think that is the case???

But I do know from another world, that when I got a DEC machine, I also 
had to contact DEC to *transfer* the license to me. The fact that the 
seller had a license did not mean he could just hand the paper over and 
then I had a license.

   Johnny

-- 
Johnny Billquist                  || "I'm on a bus
                                   ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt at softjar.se             ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive!                     ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol